Delphi or FreePascal?

**Setharian** · 05-05-2007, 07:52 AM

still such optimizations hardly match hand-tuned assembly....and you use that when you really need it...compiler speeding up trivial loops by unrolling and vectorization which get called once a time ain't much of an improvement for the user, it's a "show-off" for the compiler more like

at least that's my opinion...definetely it's good for those who do not know assembly and cannot hand-tune stuff by themselves...

**wodzu** · 05-05-2007, 09:57 AM

Yes, it does. We don't have a good loop vectorizer though, so don't expect many SIMD tricks from FPC.

But still its a great news. You guys do an excellent job with FPC

**JSoftware** · 05-05-2007, 07:45 PM

Originally Posted by dmantione

Originally Posted by wodzu

So..FPC compiler generates assembly code with usage of new CPU functions?

Yes, it does. We don't have a good loop vectorizer though, so don't expect many SIMD tricks from FPC.

I didn't know that. How does the compiled exe handle a computer without sse if it was built with sse code generation set?

**dmantione** · 05-05-2007, 09:01 PM

The program won't run. You will have to decide between performance and compatibility, or ship two exes.

**JSoftware** · 05-05-2007, 09:55 PM

That's a too big hassle for me then...

I also wouldn't trust a compiler to optimize a loop with simd tricks. I could however trust fpc if the rtl had simd optimized rtl functions which would be easy to maintain while the interface could be completely transparent

**Chebmaster** · 06-05-2007, 07:25 AM

1. The IDE in the free version, Turbo Delphi, is based on .NET, and thus is practically useless for me, since the .NET applications cannot run in Linux (my preferred choice of a desktop OS).

2. Delphi does not allow you to write native Linux applications, not to say about the potential to write for Mac/powerpc. Considering the inevitable collapse of Microsoft, the cross-platform compatibilities becoming vital, because the percentage of Mac and Linux users will increase rapidly.

3. Other than that, my engine test did show that FPC code achieves approx. 5% lower FPS than the Delphi code. But again, the guys promised that this is temporary. FPC evolves, while Delphi is practically stalled and its future is unclear.

P.S. And yes, my initial drive out of Delphi was caused by its insane price ($1300 for the most basic version at the time, if I remember correctly).

**Setharian** · 06-05-2007, 07:49 AM

Originally Posted by Chebmaster

Considering the inevitable collapse of Microsoft

in 100 years? maybe

until then I'll stick with Windows

still it's true FPC is the only solution when you want cross-platform code...

**Chebmaster** · 06-05-2007, 08:14 AM

in 100 years? maybe

[in an ominous voice]
Soviet Union looked a monolith that will stay forever. So did 3dfx. The impregnable titans challenging the time itself.
Where are they now? [runs a trickle of ashes through his fingers] Huh?
Microsoft made their share of lethal mistakes and their fate is sealed. Relying only on Windows today is like traveling via Titanic without a life jacket in your luggage! Big, yes. Comfortable, yes. Iceberg ahead included.

So, FPC and only FPC.

**wodzu** · 06-05-2007, 08:46 AM

Soviet Union looked a monolith that will stay forever. So did 3dfx. The impregnable titans challenging the time itself.

Putting 3dfx between Soviet Union and Microsoft is some sort of misunderstanding. That company last only few years and never had bilions of dolars. 3D market was to young to predict and only Voodoo 1 was beyond comparision. Voodoo 2 didn't stay ahead of Riva 128 in performance (if I remember correctly).
And Soviet Union was ruled by the leaders which didn't care about people. I think Micorsoft cares about its customers (sometimes better sometimes worser but still) and now number of those customers is much much larger than entire Soviet Union population ever was.

**Chebmaster** · 06-05-2007, 10:47 AM

And Soviet Union was ruled by the leaders which didn't care about people.

Sorry to disappoint you, but they *did* care. Problem is, they lost the touch with their "customers" needs and tried to enforce their own views of what is best. Just like M$ today.

I think Micorsoft cares about its customers

They *think* they care, but in fact they live so isolated lives at their campus that they lost the ties to the real life. They just don't comprehend how one could *not* have 3Gb RAM and a broadband Internet.

Even the Windows XP (2001) which is used today on most of the machines needs *twice* as much resources to run the same tasks smoothly than the much newer Linuxes (2005-2006) do. But Vista is reported to be much, much worse. The gargantuan system requirements and DRM complexities will sink this Titanic sooner or later - see the harrowing stories at http://badvista.fsf.org/ . Many customers prefer to stick to the old good XP, others get fed with ms and move to Ubuntu.

Now, if M$ did a smart move and base their next one on Unix like Apple did... :roll:

So, in this perspective FPC is the best.
By installing the fpc_crosswin32 package, you can easily develop Windows applications in Linux. You can even build and package Win32 and Linux versions from one script.

Other than that, most of the Win32 applications compiled in both Delphi and FreePascal run in Linux without any problems.