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Thread: Increasing traffic on PGD...

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by SilverWarior View Post
    Here in Slovenia none of our universities doesn't teach programing in any of the pascal dialects. All that you can learn in our universities is Java, .NET and C based languages. And even teaching of theese languages is of poor quality becouse they teach the mostly same stuf as they did 10 years ago. So when most of our students come out of school they still lacks some needed knowledge to become sucsessful programers on their own.
    Unfortunately, it is true for Java, .NET and C part. Another unfortunate fact is that here in Mexico the highest paid Software Engineering jobs require Java and/or .NET knowledge, which is probably why they teach these languages in the first place, to ensure student's quick entry into business (I see announcements for these jobs on daily basis).

    However, I don't agree with the second part. Ex-students of my 1999-2004 generation from Computing Systems department are all working now in top places in the software development industry, some here in Mexico and others in U.S.

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverWarior View Post
    Another problem in Slovenia is that all of theese universities are full. So if you didn't have excelent grades in highschool you don't even have a chance to sign in.
    Also here in Slovenia it is werry hard to get any scholarship at all. And even if you do get it, it won't cover all the expenses for study. So many students are forced to do parttime jobs during study. And this means les time and energy for study itself.
    You can always try to get to the universities in other countries. Yes, it may be hard to pull it off on your own (living and studying alone in foreign land), but on the bright side you get to know new cultures, make new friends and later on it will be a bonus for the career. In addition, it's never too late to get the degree, when I was studying 6 years ago for M.Sc., most "classmates" (it was research-oriented, so we were technically researchers) were like 20 years older than me. Not to mention my research for D.Sc., where only few people were present and were all > 50 years old.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    That's only good for students and academics, and more hassle that getting Visual Studio or Eclipse (which can be download with no fuss).
    Yes, I agree with that and it's unfortunate for Embarcadero. However, if you have used Express editions of Visual Studio, you should know that you don't get 64-bit support as well as other platforms such as Windows Phone, so it's very similar to Delphi Starter, except that it is for free. (Honestly, I wouldn't use Delphi Starter even if it was free because of the above limitations).

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    How, I don't doubt there are good institutions, but "many" is another story entirely, and anyway, that's only for the student side, and only for those students that have taken such a course, so it is only an option for a small minority.
    I've never seen such an argument before that contained in itself more logical fallacies than phrases. Cherry picking, base rate neglect, illicit major and hasty generalization among others. Please don't do that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    As you just said, these course take a lot of time. Some require a background. Many are heavy on theory, light on practical aspects, etc. They're just not (and can't be) and alternative to more focused articles. They cater a different crowd with different needs.
    Same as above.

    "Good" or "bad" institution is subjective and a trend of black and white thinking (yet another fallacy). They are simply institutions with the goal of teaching students. Subjects from computer sciences are present in almost every area of institutions: management, accounting, physics, chemistry, architecture and so on. Yes, you can learn by yourself reading some articles on Internet, but instead of learning random bits by yourself, you can let other people professionally certified to help and guide you with the learning process; in fact, both are not mutually exclusive: you can learn at university and *still* read articles you want.

    As for your "time argument", I don't believe there is such thing as "easy" or "quick "money. A person who worked hard and long, who invested time and effort into learning and becoming a professional will usually get higher salary and better jobs than a person who did not. (even though there are always rare exceptions.)

    In addition, education is not just programming. If you don't educate yourself enough, you may fall prey easily to Crown manipulation, Brainwashing among other techniques very common on today's mass media including TV, radio, social networks and so on. (And guess what? Many of these techniques are based on careful injection of fallacies!)

    [By the way, the Wikipedia links I've provided to crowd manipulation and brainwashing in English are quite biased and misleading themselves. Check other language versions with the Google translator, which are more meaningful.]


    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    What I'm saying is that I don't think PGD should assume a public constituted of software engineering PhDs ;-)
    Referring to my point, you are making a logical fallacy called "Appeal to ridicule". I never said what you are mocking (which is disrespectful, by the way), I just said that basic programming skills are taught in the majority of institutions now so instead of reinventing the wheel it is better to focus on people that are already familiar with the language.

    Also, there is an entire Delphi section in About web site dedicated to all sorts of programming tips, which is more than sufficient to get you started and even make you proficient in some areas that you may not be aware of.

    Edit: Really, please check Delphi section in About.com, it has articles for beginners to start from zero. What else do you need?
    Last edited by LP; 23-02-2012 at 06:02 PM.

  2. #22
    Co-Founder / PGD Elder WILL's Avatar
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    Well I can assure everyone that PGD will not become a support group purely for any one singular IDE, compiler or platform. In fact I believe that the increased development towards new platforms might be what's been making core Delphi developers think otherwise. There seems to be this odd conception amoung Pascal developers that you have to choose either one of the tools or the other. I'd use Delphi on my Mac if there was a native version. Maybe it will come, maybe not, but until then I use Lazarus.

    My support goes to the language. And other dialects of the language.

    There has been a lot of Delphi relevant topics posted in the News section, but not as much news as I'd like being posted there. Part of that is because I've been away and busy doing my real job which supports my family and unable to spend the time I'd love in finding new and cool things going on with ALL Pascal game developers. This is where I really need your help.

    Since we have been airing fears; I kind of fear that the PGD News section/RSS isn't as popular as it should be. Not sure who here reads from RSS syndication feeds or subscribes to DelphiFeeds.com. I've put PGD up for inclusion to these feeds, but it seems we didn't get enough votes. Should enough people sign up and have us added, that might finally put us on there.

    The only time that we do make it on there is when someone like Eric Grange or Jon Lennart Aasenden mentions something we've posted. I think our RSS feed for news is very valid, but noone else has spoken up about it. Here is the thread http://delphifeeds.uservoice.com/for...-com-news-rss- Apparently 3 votes won't do it. So who here actually wants PGD on DelphiFeeds or thinks we should be on there?

    Go here and vote about it please! http://delphifeeds.uservoice.com/forums/14264-feedback
    Jason McMillen
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  3. #23
    Co-Founder / PGD Elder WILL's Avatar
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    BTW, I've slimmed down the Forums a bit. I don't know if I want to merge all the development tools together much like I don't want to merge all the library-specific forums either. Sure it would make it seem even smaller, but there is a reason we made each forum for all of them. Maybe moving discontinued ones to an archive of some kind instead.
    Jason McMillen
    Pascal Game Development
    Co-Founder





  4. #24
    Here is the thread http://delphifeeds.uservoice.com/for...-com-news-rss- Apparently 3 votes won't do it.
    "Idea has been closed"...

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by WILL View Post
    Since we have been airing fears; I kind of fear that the PGD News section/RSS isn't as popular as it should be. Not sure who here reads from RSS syndication feeds or subscribes to DelphiFeeds.com. I've put PGD up for inclusion to these feeds, but it seems we didn't get enough votes. Should enough people sign up and have us added, that might finally put us on there.
    Honestly, I've never used PGD's syndication system or any other syndication system for that matter except for what I added to my Blackberry, but even that one I rarely read. For some reason I always preferred to interact with the forums and news sites directly. Maybe you should open a poll about this?

  6. #26
    I myself don't use RSS news on any site. When I'm interested in news from certain area I wisitn and browse trough respected sites and forums.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Lifepower View Post
    Also, there is an entire Delphi section in About web site dedicated to all sorts of programming tips, which is more than sufficient to get you started and even make you proficient in some areas that you may not be aware of.

    Edit: Really, please check Delphi section in About.com, it has articles for beginners to start from zero. What else do you need?
    I know Delphi About very well. Infact I learned most from that site. But sometimes there is a problem when you try to find something but instead you keep coming to wrong articles. Let's face it while Delphi About does contain a great deal of knoledge it is poorly organized wich makes it hard to find exacly what you need.

  8. #28
    Co-Founder / PGD Elder WILL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andru View Post
    "Idea has been closed"...
    I new idea can be opened. Just post here and elsewhere about it so we can get it noticed and change the number of votes. I don't think it was properly announced last time. Maybe with Facebook, Twitter, Google+ and PGD all behind it we can get the votes up to make it happen.

    I mean with some of the sites that are on DelphiFeeds.com I wonder why on earth we are not on it??

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverWarior View Post
    Let's face it while Delphi About does contain a great deal of knoledge it is poorly organized wich makes it hard to find exacly what you need.
    Yeah Delphi About is a glorified blog, not a community by design. I do appreciate Mr. Žarko Gajić's efforts to talk about and discuss Delphi/Object Pascal related things, a lot of the information posted there is a little dated and misinforming these days. I'm not sure if there is much posted that is really new, is there? I don't follow it because there is nothing really that PGD can draw from as current or new information.
    Jason McMillen
    Pascal Game Development
    Co-Founder





  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Lifepower View Post
    However, if you have used Express editions of Visual Studio, you should know that you don't get 64-bit support as well as other platforms such as Windows Phone
    That's incorrect, f.i. see http://www.microsoft.com/visualstudi...eveloper-tools

    Quote Originally Posted by Lifepower View Post
    "Good" or "bad" institution is subjective and a trend of black and white thinking (yet another fallacy).
    No, it's just a fact of life. If it was a fallacy, then there would be no competition to enter the best ones.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lifepower View Post
    you can let other people professionally certified to help and guide you with the learning process
    Well, I've met enough "professionally certified" personnel to take those with a truckload of salt, especially when they're from a pure academic background, and I've met quite few. ;-)

    That doesn't mean I say you should throw baby with the bathwater, but that acquiring a degree and mastering a trade are not the same thing, learning in institutions can be highly beneficial, but students have to work beyond academic requirements for that, and search for themselves, yes, in the internet and in other sources, as well as put things in practice in non-academic situations (that last bit being key).

    Quote Originally Posted by Lifepower View Post
    in fact, both are not mutually exclusive: you can learn at university and *still* read articles you want
    You not only can, but should IMHO. If only to put the academic learning in perspective.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lifepower View Post
    As for your "time argument", I don't believe there is such thing as "easy" or "quick "money. A person who worked hard and long, who invested time and effort into learning and becoming a professional will usually get higher salary and better jobs than a person who did not.
    I guess we have a major incomprehension here, I'm not a student, and many PGD visitors aren't and won't be. They won't be going back to university full-time, and even part-time university can be quite problematic when you have a full-time job already and children.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lifepower View Post
    If you don't educate yourself enough, you may fall prey easily to...
    I guess you skipped the part on me saying I already have quite a high degree, and got it, hmmm, almost 15 years ago. So what I'm referring to is mostly what I get from new hires & interns.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lifepower View Post
    Edit: Really, please check Delphi section in About.com, it has articles for beginners to start from zero. What else do you need?
    Check the flipcode archives, that's rather the kind of articles I would be expecting on a site like PGD (pity flipcode went away btw).
    http://www.flipcode.com/archives/

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by WILL View Post
    So who here actually wants PGD on DelphiFeeds or thinks we should be on there?
    I was surprised it wasn't, maybe when it was submitted there weren't enough things in the RSS? or they had some issue accessing the RSS?

    I wasn't aware it was submitted and there was a vote, maybe submit it anew and have us notified so we can vote!

    Also, you may want to expose it through feedburner: the RSS can be requested quite often as it's a polled protocol. Using feedburner will redirect the load onto google's servers rather than PGD's. At least for my site, before moving it to feedburner, at some point it was the #1 source of bandwidth consumption.

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