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View Full Version : Are you going commercial? Read this!



WILL
03-07-2005, 10:08 PM
Hi guys, after adding several bits of game industry content to the Library section, I was wondering... is this of any use to PGD users? How many people are actually going to go commercial and try to publish their work commercially? Whats this factor like for us Pascal developers...?

So tell us, how amoung you are going to go and take that step? And what sort of area of the commercial market are you interested in exploring? Any thing you want answers to or seek guidance on?

Let us know! ;)

cairnswm
04-07-2005, 04:18 AM
I have release a shareware game and will in the future do so again.

I am also in the process of developing a mass market entertainment product that is directly related to games. I have a partner and we have approached interested parties to sell it.

Other than my own options I fell that if the site doesn;t at least have some commercial items of it, we are indicating a lack of seriousness in the viability of pascal to generate commercial products.

Firlefanz
04-07-2005, 06:40 AM
Hi!

We are a team of 3 pepole and published 2 shareware games until now, the 3rd is in progress. We always earn less than we spent for new software, but we see this as a hobby. :D

Right now our games can be downloaded and we are linked to many shareware sites, I would be interested in getting the game(s) into a store or on a game sampler or something, even if it is for a few bucks. :wink:

Firle

WiZz
04-07-2005, 09:24 AM
Hi, I am not very good programer so, haven't done any commercial game, but in our little country one man created game and published it by local publisher. if you are interested www.adirex.com (used Delphi+GLScene)

Ultra
04-07-2005, 08:16 PM
I am also interested in doing shareware (even though I haven't anything so far). However the stuff I'm interested in is mostly marketing, what kind of product I should make, and other such more business oriented questions. As this have little to do with actual Pascal programming it may not fit this site...

WILL
04-07-2005, 10:09 PM
Hi, I am not very good programer so, haven't done any commercial game, but in our little country one man created game and published it by local publisher. if you are interested www.adirex.com (used Delphi+GLScene)

This is excellent. :) Not a bad start up either. Clean page, very little errors... nice use of marketing! And one more wayward DelphiGamer banner I've been hunting down to get replaced. :lol:


I am also interested in doing shareware (even though I haven't anything so far). However the stuff I'm interested in is mostly marketing, what kind of product I should make, and other such more business oriented questions. As this have little to do with actual Pascal programming it may not fit this site...

Actually this is the sort of thing I want PGD to start covering a bit more. Pascal users have been denied this too much on the game side of development. So long as it can relate to Pascal-based games. Which (if anyone in the last 5 years or has been paying attention to the availablility of the language) pretty much covers it all. :)

I'll keep cranking out the marketing articles and items that go into the Library. On that note, I just added some great article on Shareware so please have a look. ;)

Crisp_N_Dry
05-07-2005, 07:15 PM
While not actively part of the indie dev scene I do plan on marketing a release as soon as I complete a project that I deem worthy of a mass market. It always strikes me as odd that some projects that are sold at retail or as shareware are of lesser quality than many freeware titles. The project I have in mind is quite reliant on quality 2D graphics (Of the PixelArt variety) and I guess this is my main stumbling block. Graphics cost money which is something someone like me (Average joe with 0 collateral) is hard to come by, but even if I spent a few thousand pounds of my own money on the graphics, as long as long as the finished game fits my vision I would quite willingly pay out whether I made money back on the project or not. Which is why I am holding out until I have something approaching finished before I look into shelling out for third party graphics and sound.

lief
11-07-2005, 01:09 AM
contact me when you need art.
portfolio available, a few games here you can see my graphics.
cheap rates for indie developers - im an indie artist :)

liefjorgensen@hotmail.com

BlueCat
29-07-2005, 12:54 PM
I definitely plan to go commercial. I just need to know that there's a market for whatever I plan to make before I spend months working on it :roll:

If anyone wants to start a commercial game project with me let me know. ;)

BlueCat
29-07-2005, 12:57 PM
In fact the same applies for a non game project, it's the commercial bit I'm interested in at the moment. :lol:

Paulius
29-07-2005, 01:21 PM
Doing stuff you like is good, earning money by doing it is better. I hope to go shareware eventually. What kind of cooperation do you suggest BlueCat? I mean we?_Tre almost all programmers here, we can only bug each other about each others bugs.

cairnswm
29-07-2005, 01:39 PM
I would be interested in doing some cooperation in getting a game done. I am however pretty inflexible in the tools and technologies used, at the moment if I was to work on a game project I would insist on:

Language: Delphi (also keeping in mind FreePascal compilation)
Graphics: SDL using OpenGL
Sound: SDL_Mixer or OpenAL

Most likely using Reiners Sprites

I was thinking that the Dragon Flight game I wrote actually has a lot of potential. There is a market for vertical shooters out there. Most shooters are space themed and a fantasy themed one like Dragon Flight may catch a slightly different market.

If you (or anyone else) would be interested in trying to get this to work (or anything else with me) register yourself on my forums and lets talk about it.

Paulius
29-07-2005, 01:42 PM
Another problem with cooperating, everyone wants help with their projects, but very rarelly wants to join sombody elses.

cairnswm
29-07-2005, 01:59 PM
Great point - and I am no exception :)

However - and I think this is quite important - I do have a proven track record of finished games - previous projects I've tried to work online on have died because the leader of the project lost interest. I hope that the number of completed games I have is an indication that I would make a more successful leader :)

(That sounds like boasting but was supposed to be justification for someone to join my projects :) )

BlueCat
29-07-2005, 02:34 PM
Well I find that being part of a team, whether it's 2 people or 10, gives me a lot more motivation to make some kind of progress with a project. Please don't read that as, 'I like to see someone else doing all the work'

That doesn't mean I'm not a self-motivating person, it means I have a lot of other things that can get in the way if a project doesn't seem important enough and if I'm working on my own that has been a problem in the past.

Now though, I'm in a situation where this would be my full time job and I would have to give it everything it deserved.

My 'work' on game projects in the past has been for fun and on things that really interest me. If I could combine fun with something that will sell that would be ideal.

So I'm serious when I say I want to work on a project with at least one other person.

PS There's nothing I can do about Eriken posting something sarcastic after this so bring it on I say :lol:

cairnswm
29-07-2005, 02:44 PM
The most important thing is to complete projects :)

I work full time (about 12 hours a day, 6 days a week at the moment) but typically I find 5-15 hours a week for my games. I want desperatly to produce something for shareware again and would be willing to work with someone to get it done.

BlueCat
29-07-2005, 03:53 PM
I agree about completing projects. There's not a lot of point starting if you're going to stop half way.

I have an old terrain engine in opengl that's hanging around my hard drive somewhere that some of you may have been lucky enough to see :lol:

I worked on it for a couple of years on and off and the last thing I did was use ODE to make cars that you could drive around the terrain. That was fun to work on and I'll always thought I'd turn it into a game someday.

Here's an old version of it from about 2 years ago before the cars and nice cameras but with physics and strange fruit references:

http://terraqueous.f2o.org/downloads

You need to download fruitballs.zip!

Not the best terrain engine ever but I wrote it myself so it's free ;)

So this might be involved in some future project or not, I don't mind really.

Have to go out now, but have lots more to say about this when I get back later.

Eriken
29-07-2005, 04:18 PM
"something sarcastic".. now it's said.. happy now? ;)

I think I've been lucky enough to see fruitballs before, and some of your other work BlueCat ;) (I can't remember why though :twisted:)

But in the discussion on the fact that people want to have others join their project and not join other's projects I guess it's a matter of who you are. At this point I would rather join someone elses project and help out where I can.. (Yes BlueCat, that would be me sitting in the back and make jokes about it all :P )

Only problem I've seen so far with teamwork is to get realtime meetings/chats as people tend to have their own schedules/timezones to struggle with ;)

* Eriken sits down and waits for BlueCat's next posting show.

Paulius
29-07-2005, 09:20 PM
The masses demand more fruits. Anyway doesn?_Tt long precalculation time hurt developing process, or is it just me who likes recompiling and having a look around after changing every couple of lines? Maybe do calculations on first run, save to file and reload on all other runs?

BlueCat
29-07-2005, 10:51 PM
The masses demand more fruits

Ah but you must wait my children the blue cat master of the fruits has drunken much wine and you wil not achive enlitenenment until he is able to spell such words again.....

I will respond to the caclulation stuff tomorow it is dark and raining :right: :right: :right: :right: :right: :right: :right: :right:

BlueCat
29-07-2005, 10:54 PM
* Eriken sits down and waits for BlueCat's next posting show.

Try to get some sleep Eriken I know it is excitting but you must rest old thing

the woot tag isn't working

Eriken
30-07-2005, 08:57 AM
I... can't... sleep...

It's like waiting for NASA to fire up some rockets.. You never know when BlueCat posts, and you never know if he's able to launch, or if he ever comes back.. Exciting it is..
_____
Eriken

BlueCat
30-07-2005, 01:03 PM
Just making some pre flight checks now... Won't be much longer....

WILL
30-07-2005, 07:26 PM
I've just added a few articles to the Library mostly about marketing and the project development side of things. Posters here should be interested in them.

BlueCat
30-07-2005, 09:28 PM
Thanks WILL, definitely worth a read :)

"How to screw up a game company...." is useful but I'm already pretty good at that sort of thing :lol:

BlueCat
30-07-2005, 10:42 PM
My problem is the same as Eriken's (no not that one :P ), it's hard to get a 'real job' in software without a few years' commercial experience on your CV/resume. I've been programming for more than 20 years now and have the qualifications to back it up but it means almost nothing to potential employers without a fair bit of recent commercial experience. I understand why this is and can see the logic in it but that doesn't pay my bills :evil: . The only way to get a 'real job' in software where I live is if you have 20 years commercial experience and don't mind getting paid about half what you'd get in a city. The main alternative around here is to work in the tourist industry which usually means dressing up as a bear for half the year and serving food and drinks to old people for the other six months, sometimes these tasks will overlap between seasons :lol:

So I'm thinking of doing something longer term than one game project. I want to develop high quality Pascal based software, games if possible, that people want to buy and make a living from it.

And yes, I will dress up as a bear if I have to...

http://www.partypants.fsnet.co.uk/female/fd-teddybear.jpg

Daikrys
02-08-2005, 01:15 AM
hey guys,

iam also interessted in making indie games
but it is also hard to get some hits

at time i work on my engine :roll:

i will also join a team, i need:
an artist for modelling
or an good programmer
or for fun to learn a lot :P


i dont miss articles about game industry, i miss some about
physic, intersection(collision) and effect progrmming etc.

i think Momor is going to be commercial in mobile games

on www.indiegamer.com (thanks cairnswm for the side link)
i viewed some salesstates, Xeno Assault II was selling 500 times
that mean:
500*20$=10000$ :shock:

hm if you interessted in teamwork feel free to contact me :wink:

WILL
02-08-2005, 01:54 AM
500*20$=10000$ :shock:

Ah but that is just net... you are more interested in gross. Net is how much you made before all the fees, taxes and such. Gross is after.

So minus a few thousand for licences(libraries, media, engines, etc used), taxes (the government needs it's cut too), marketing and delivery(if you make anything physical like Boxes, Labels, CDs or Manuals and so on).

Depending on how much you manage to by-pass, it can still cost you quite a bit. Esp. if someone else is doing all the marking for you. ie. Edios, Virgin Interactive, etc...

Traveler
02-08-2005, 08:21 AM
yeah, true. I think I read somewhere on PGD that of 20, you only 50% or so.

Btw, WILL it' s the other way around.
Net is after reductions, taxes and such. Gross is total before deductions.

Daikrys
02-08-2005, 11:22 AM
yeah sure you may sell some games before with selling 0 hits or some hits
i think the best teacher is experience :wink:

when you dont pay to sell your game(download.com premium etc.) you will have only
5%-13% to pay for the registrtion shareware site

it is easy to say, i know but its the expierence that forms you :roll:

i hope much of us go commercial and join a team together :D

Eriken
02-08-2005, 11:56 AM
i think Momor is going to be commercial in mobile games
Too bad mobile games are done in Java.. It sort of reminds me of the old days, where you had to program with limited memory on the C64 or Spectrum to get anything on the screen ;) So I am comparing today's mobilephones with Spectrum 48K, for the fun of it. (I don't feel so old then, since I first touched Spectrum in 1982 or something like that ;))
_____
Eriken

Daikrys
02-08-2005, 01:45 PM
mobile games are populare iam thinking too
to make mobile games i code in jave sience 2years

MikeS
02-08-2005, 06:48 PM
I plan on going commercial with my object pascal games. Well, right now I'm still learning OpenGL, so in due time I'll have a few small games. After that, I'm interested in developing tools(terrain creation, 3d model apps(like DeleD ;)),etc.).

8)

WILL
02-08-2005, 08:37 PM
Btw, WILL it' s the other way around.
Net is after reductions, taxes and such. Gross is total before deductions.
Oops! I stand corrected. :)


Well cell phones are not the only portable game platforms these days. There are still PDAs (PocketPC and Palm), GameBoy (Advance/Nintendo DS), and PSP. And all have limited memory, displays and processing power too.

I think that almost all of it can be covered via Pascal. Free Pascal is a gateway to that, in that if someone modivated enough got interested, it could happen.

And it would be a great place to start out I think. If you were truely wanting to go commercial. The only barrier I see with the above options, or more specifically PSP and GBA/DS, is that licencing from Nintendo and Sony might be a chanllange since they are very strict on what compilers are used. I have plans on looking into this as I like the idea of promoting Free Pascal as a commercially viable solution for game development on consoles aswell as the PC-based platforms(including Macs).