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EmbranceII
10-06-2007, 03:53 PM
What pascal is lacking in general. I was thinking, how come C and C++ have so many followers? What makes the difference?
Then I wanted to find some good game examples on Pascal. but couldnt find any. I wanted to do some basic DOS graphic stuff, but then, what was compatible with one compiler wouldnt be with another. Not to mention for the same compiler line(example, what works for FPC v1, probably wont work on v2)

Then I looked the other side and there was C/C++ with TONS of tutorials and TONS of demo source codes. And guess what. All libraries pretty much worked everywhere, with no problems.

Now you will ask what my point is here.So here it is:

-For a small community of coders, like people who use Pascal, is idiotic at least to not release the sources of your program. Dont misjudge me, I dont mean you are idiots or something,what I mean is that while some projects progress then they are abandoned and neither the author makes a penny from them, and neither the other people can benefit on learning something form the sources.

-So many libraries, and no tutorials for them. not to make a complete/demo game,but no even instructions on how to setup them.

-Complete lack of tutorials,guides,even personal sites, because people wont share heir ideas and work.

-Like 20 libraries that do the same exact thing and half of them are broken. See SDL for example.

JernejL
10-06-2007, 05:23 PM
give examples - which libraries lack documentation?

If you want tutorials, go to sulaco.co.za, NeHe also has all tutorials in delphi code, then you can go and visit delphi3d.net and get more delphi tutorials..

then there is glscene, with TONS of examples with source code..

WILL
10-06-2007, 07:06 PM
Hey Embrace.

Well I personally do release some sources from time to time. I won't give away any of my IP stuff that I plan on making a profit from, but I do release other things like my input library and the tutorial series which uses a simplified version of my base code for new (SDL only) projects.

What do you mean with your example of SDL? Do you mean JEDI-SDL or something else related to SDL projects specifically?

EmbranceII
11-06-2007, 12:48 AM
I speak generally here. We are lacking the "basic" here, and thats the most critical issue in the whole thing.(guides,books,tutorials,easy to follow steps)

Setharian
11-06-2007, 06:47 AM
this hasn't to do only with game programming, it's in general...most of the tutorials, demos, libraries, code examples for Pascal are well...simple :) they are not complex like C/C++ ones....of course there are JCL, JVCL, GLScene and many more great libraries so not all is lost :)....I wish there was a site like codeproject which also contained articles on Object Pascal and code....

FNX
11-06-2007, 08:25 AM
I think that is not true Embrance, i've always found everything i need with
a bit of search, both for gamedev and business coding.

Also if you can use delphi (any version) or lazarus, which i think is the
same, remember that the VCL is open source, you can go there and learn
a lot, really! :)

I ask to admins anyway, can we/you make a more detailed links section?
I mean, NEHE banner (which a newbie would not know what is about) is
just under my FNX Games banner for example, it doesnt' help.

I would modify the page into a bit more detailed section like:

Tutorials and samples:

NEHE (banner): OpenGL tutorials for Delphi and more... (brief description)
....

What do you think? :D

About samples well, i personally don't like to release my sources because
you won't learn much from them, i learned from tutorials and samples
(what a case uh? ;) ) here and there and modified for my own needs.
About the game itself i've never looked into someone else code, i prefer
to solve stuff my own in my own way :)

Everything absolutely IMHO! :D

EDIT: forgot to mention that at the glorious age of DOS i used to learn
turbo pascal stuff from SWAG! Great archive of sources, you can find
everything here really, even VGA mode gfx!

http://www.bsdg.org/SWAG/index.html

RE-EDITED:
DarknessX has just opened another topic related to this:
http://www.pascalgamedevelopment.com/viewtopic.php?t=4552

wodzu
11-06-2007, 12:26 PM
What pascal is lacking in general. I was thinking, how come C and C++ have so many followers? What makes the difference?
....
Then I looked the other side and there was C/C++ with TONS of tutorials and TONS of demo source codes. And guess what. All libraries pretty much worked everywhere, with no problems.



I think that you are looking on it from the wrong side. It is not that C/C++ has so many followers because of a TONS of examples. TONS of examples exists because C/C++ has so many followers.

Why it is like this? I don't know. Maybe because Microsoft abandoned their Pascal compiler and this decreased Pascal popularity. Oh and there is a thing like "Pascal is for kids", "Pascal is slower/worser than C" spread all the time.

Almindor
12-06-2007, 08:32 AM
Start writing those guides and tutorials then

DarknessX
12-06-2007, 01:09 PM
Well, to be truthful Almindor... Thats the reason I am starting to write my tutorials for my site :D

I decided now that I'm out of school, I should get to work on my website... and what better way then adding some tutorials?

Almindor
15-06-2007, 07:29 AM
Well, to be truthful Almindor... Thats the reason I am starting to write my tutorials for my site :D

I decided now that I'm out of school, I should get to work on my website... and what better way then adding some tutorials?

Yup, people always bitch about some thing missing in OSS software and or free/volunteer things like PGD. The point is, what's not done is doable. That's how these things work, you either sit there and moan, or you actually get to do something useful.

I'm slowly writing a "booklette" (serious latex/pdf :D) about Free Pascal, it's usage (installation on variousOSes etc.), language (from basics to advanced OOP) and Lazarus. It's going slowly, but I hope to have something done by the end of summer. (still an exam in front of me currently).

WILL
15-06-2007, 01:56 PM
Well done Al! If you get it published, please let us all know. :)

Bijo
15-06-2007, 05:16 PM
Hmm, if I were good enough at serious programming -- I mean real skill in making serious things -- I'd perhaps contribute some programming stuff. In the meanwhile I'll try to convince beginning programmers -- wherever I find them -- to use FreePascal. Hopefully it would enlarge the Pascal (gaming) community, even if in vain (for most beginners would probably choose Python which is okay (but not okay for the Pascal community (or worse: C++)).

Fortunately, I make serious effort at making my reasoning and logic correct and convinceable.