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  1. #1
    Co-Founder / PGD Elder WILL's Avatar
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    Exclamation 3rd PGD Challenge Questions

    Hello to everyone that has taken up the challenge!

    Be proud to be among the elite, they few who rouse up to charge forth and take destiny in your hands by creating your masterpiece, your legacy. However, don't be too proud to ask those daunting questions that would fester and push your project down into ruin. Post and be heard, for your questions have merit and I have an ear, so we shall converse and with hope, be enlightened.

    I'll shut-up so you can ask now.
    Jason McMillen
    Pascal Game Development
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  2. #2
    Co-Founder / PGD Elder WILL's Avatar
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    ok first questions asked....

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverWarior View Post
    I got a few questions?
    Yes, I conclude that you do indeed have questions! Next question! (sorry been up since 6am and it's now midnight and I'm a little loopy on caffeine)

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverWarior View Post
    Does the "protagonist" have to be visible in game? Idea of a game where you are controlling your whole kingdom from kings point of wiew. You are just isuing orders which are caried out by your units. These units aren't even rendered in the game as the king isn't able to see them when they are on the other side of the kingdom.
    There must be at least "A" protagonist meaning there must be at least one conceptualized within the game. This could be the king himself... animate him standing up to make a "decree" which is your selected orders... just a thought. If selecting from a list of "dialog" and/or text options or some kind of button interface that would be somewhat indirect I believe.

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverWarior View Post
    Can I make a game where I as a captian controll the ship by simply isueing orders like (turn left, turn right, set heading to, hoist all sails, fire port cannons, etc.)?
    Well to be clear, if you are simple making a virtual controller UI that directly controls the game, this does not fall within the spirit of the challenge and shouldn't be considered a valid means of INdirectly controlling your protagonist(s), however if you were issuing commands like a captain and then the crew were listening and then independently reacting (perhaps even with some kind of balanced delay to make sure it's known and to add a challenge to playing the game?) then that would indeed exactly fall in-line within the context of challenge theme.

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverWarior View Post
    How much autonomy could my "protagonists" have? Can I make a game where my characters are compleetly autonomus (I don't even need to isue any commands)?
    You can use any level of autonomy you deem fit. In this challenge theme you cannot use too much autonomously "controlled" characters Protagonist or any other kind in your game. Specification of AUTOMATION is merely a suggestion to highlight one of the ways you would likely be able to achieve the goal of a functioning protagonist in lieu of it being controlled directly by the player of the game. In this theme it might also just be a great way to add more factors to this kind of enforced game mechanics.


    If anyone else has any questions of the sort, I'm an open book.

    WARNING: Humour may ensue over the next few hours. I've been up for a bit and working on my current project it half driving me mad. Oh and caffeine helps too.
    Jason McMillen
    Pascal Game Development
    Co-Founder





  3. #3
    So a RTS counts as an indirectly controlled game? I've never realised it as such because I can choose my units and point where they have to go (IMHO a direct control). But anyway, if a RTS counts what about a point and click adventure in the spirit of Monkey Island? It's quite the same control of the protagonist, so this should count, too?
    Best regards,
    Cybermonkey

    Pulsar2D framework:
    http://pulsar2d.org

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by WILL View Post
    There must be at least "A" protagonist meaning there must be at least one conceptualized within the game. This could be the king himself... animate him standing up to make a "decree" which is your selected orders... just a thought. If selecting from a list of "dialog" and/or text options or some kind of button interface that would be somewhat indirect I believe.

    ... however if you were issuing commands like a captain and then the crew were listening and then independently reacting (perhaps even with some kind of balanced delay to make sure it's known and to add a challenge to playing the game?) then that would indeed exactly fall in-line within the context of challenge theme.
    My idea was that my units (messangers, soldiers, hunters, farmers, pesants, etc) would actually be protagonists and not the king itself. But I would limit the game screen to the kings view itself.

    So the game mechanic would be somthing like this:
    A messenger brings the message about some event that happened somewhere in your kingdom.
    You as a king are offered different choices of what command would you isue.
    After you iseue an order a message explaining the order needs to be caried to the unit that you are giving the order to.
    Becouse sometimes messangers needs to travel long distances it takes time for your order to actually reach your units. It can even be intercepted by bandits, enemies, etc.
    After the message is delivered an cofirmation message is being sent back.

    All the units ingame are being simulated but not being rendered. I try to minimize the graphic assets needed for this game. Maybe I can even pull it of as a text game.

    So would this fit into the rules?

  5. #5
    Co-Founder / PGD Elder WILL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cybermonkey View Post
    So a RTS counts as an indirectly controlled game? I've never realised it as such because I can choose my units and point where they have to go (IMHO a direct control). But anyway, if a RTS counts what about a point and click adventure in the spirit of Monkey Island? It's quite the same control of the protagonist, so this should count, too?
    I would say that it's a little too close to direct control. Even the traditional RTS would feel a little bit like cheating. It would be too easy to "cop out" and just use only that form of control, where the spirit of the theme is to try to do something a little more than just a virtual form of abstracting the standard direct control mechanism found in most games. Surely there are more interesting ways of indirectly controlling a single character protagonist?

    Maybe making sound causing him to want to investigate? Or scaring him/it away from somewhere by making a bang or something? Would be more interesting than simple saying "walk here" or "perform action here" which is far less creative I think.

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverWarior View Post
    My idea... ...So would this fit into the rules?
    Yeah, that seems pretty legit. Is there perhaps another form of feedback you can get from your distant followers that show what kind of progress they do or do not do? I mean if the poor messenger gets shot how can you tell? Perhaps a view of buildings begin built or farms that grow or enemies on the horizon that can be see out a window from the castle or something? You may be able to come up with a low content way of doing that somehow.
    Jason McMillen
    Pascal Game Development
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  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by WILL View Post
    Is there perhaps another form of feedback you can get from your distant followers that show what kind of progress they do or do not do? I mean if the poor messenger gets shot how can you tell?
    That is the point. You have to maintain good enough security inside your kingdom so messengers can travel quite safetly.
    And if you see that there was no messenger from one of your places for quite some time you have to send someone to investigate why is that.
    But messangers are not the only units who needs security inside your kingdom.
    For instance for your castle to get the food to feed your staff that food needs to be transported from neigboring farms, vilages, towns. Same goes to other wares.
    Also pepole inside your kingdom won't be hapy if bandids would roam the streets robbing traveling merchants, pilaging vilages, etc.

    BTW Your messangers won't be the only units which could bring you the status update. You could also learn of various events around your kingdom from from traveling merchants. But this information is not guaranteed to be thruth as they would only be rumors.
    I also have a nice idea for rumor system where stories can get exagerated but I probably won't be able to implement it as it would take quite a lot of coding.

    Like I sad the game will show off all the dificulties that kingdom/empires faced when there still was no radio cominucation available.
    So don't expect playing it will be "walk in the park".

  7. #7
    Co-Founder / PGD Elder WILL's Avatar
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    I guess it's a concept that will have to be tested to see how it actually will feel while playing. You've got me interested already!

    Be sure to play test lots and be wiling to tweak and fiddle plenty when trying new "out of the box" game ideas. Not every new idea really goes smooth in it's first outing of course. It's also a good idea to be willing to rethink stuff if you just aren't getting your player experience to where you are hoping it would. Also when you are in new territory, sometimes even the most subtle of tweaks or added features can vastly change your whole game without noticing until after play testing it enough times.
    Jason McMillen
    Pascal Game Development
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