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Thread: Luna Game Pascal

  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by SilverWarior View Post
    If so why haven't you posted any of the changes you made back to Github repository? Perhaps there would be more interest from others if they would know that someone is working on PGDCE at the moment. But until now I haven't seen any indication that you are working on PGDCE and I'm checking PGD forums almost on a daily basis.
    I had simply downloaded it a while ago and was working on it locally. I was aware that the original team for the engine for some reason cared about supporting Delphi 7 (which obviously has no generics or operator overloading) meaning none of the changes I was making would be usable. It was just sort of a fun side-project for me.

    That being said, again, I'd be perfectly happy to do some "real" development on the repo and commit the changes I'd made personally if anyone was interested (after cleaning them up, haven't looked at them for a while), if it is in fact the case that people have finally realized that Delphi 7 came out in 2002 and is not something that anyone should care about supporting anymore. Also, a game engine that actual game developers might actually want to use in 2017 needs to support OpenGL 3.3+ as the default/base, with MAYBE an OpenGL 2.0 "fallback" (although personally I'd leave it out...) Leave the OpenGL 1.0 fixed function stuff "at home", as they say...
    Last edited by Akira13; 16-10-2017 at 12:56 AM.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Akira13 View Post
    That being said, again, I'd be perfectly happy to do some "real" development on the repo and commit the changes I'd made personally if anyone was interested (after cleaning them up, haven't looked at them for a while), if it is in fact the case that people have finally realized that Delphi 7 came out in 2002 and is not something that anyone should care about supporting anymore. Also, a game engine that actual game developers might actually want to use in 2017 needs to support OpenGL 3.3+ as the default/base, with MAYBE an OpenGL 2.0 "fallback" (although personally I'd leave it out...) Leave the OpenGL 1.0 fixed function stuff "at home", as they say...
    I guess dropping D7 and moving away from old GL wouldn't be much of a problem since those interested in them also wore out and don't contribute anymore

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by laggyluk View Post
    I guess dropping D7 and moving away from old GL wouldn't be much of a problem since those interested in them also wore out and don't contribute anymore
    I'm not really sure what your point is here, or whether you're agreeing or disagreeing with what I had said... but in case of the latter (or even if not, as I know there are others who do still believe D7 is the best thing since sliced bread, even if you're not one of them), here's what I think:

    The bottom line is that while yes, the merits of the newer, 2009+ Delphi versions versus FPC/Lazarus can certainly be debated, the merits of Delphi 7 vs FPC/Lazarus can't be. FPC/Lazarus is objectively better than Delphi 7 in every possible way by a huge margin. Anyone still using Delphi 7 who doesn't want to pay for a newer Delphi version should just switch to Lazarus, end of story. It is a massive upgrade for zero dollars. There's no logical argument to the contrary. (I say this as someone who used Delphi 7 professionally at the time of its release and for years afterwards, by the way. You could not pay me enough to go back to using it after having used Lazarus and newer Delphi versions for as long as I have since.)

    So, adding generics/operator overloading/e.t.c to the engine would not actually be excluding anyone, because if they didn't have access to a 2009+ Delphi version they could just use FPC/Lazarus instead, as it supports all the same modern features. (And indeed, using it with FPC would be the first choice of a large number of people, as opposed to a secondary option after Delphi.) Look at something like Castle (which arguably IS the best Object Pascal game engine there is, currently): it only very recently began to make moves towards supporting any form of Delphi at all, and for most of its existence has only supported FPC.

    Have you ever seen anyone complaining about that? No, because there is pretty much no real person that is both highly interested in using Pascal for game development, and also completely dead-set on using Delphi 7. Even when Castle does get to a point where it could be considered to have "full" Delphi support, it still absolutely will not support pre-2009 Delphi versions as it makes heavy use of generics and operator overloading. Again though, you won't see anyone complaining, because there isn't actually anyone who sees this as a problem. As I said yesterday, Delphi 7 came out in 2002. It's 15 years old!

    How much other 15-year-old computer software or hardware do you use in your daily life? Likely none. What's different about D7 that merits it an exception? Nothing, in reality. It's horribly outdated, and it's not remotely reasonable for anyone to assume that it should still be as usable in all cases as it was when they first got it. Nor do I remotely understand why they'd want to keep using it. Have you actually tried to develop anything in it recently? It's not a good user experience, at all, unless you're wearing several pairs of rose-tinted glasses.

    Lastly, to your point about "old GL": I don't think the engine was really trying to use it in the first place. It just had it in a few strange spots, presumably as placeholders. Someone with a GPU that did not support at least OpenGL 2.0 (which is virtually no one) would not have actually been able to run anything written in it anyways.
    Last edited by Akira13; 21-10-2017 at 11:03 PM.

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